Is anyone afraid or despise driving their Shelby over the clutch/flywheel issue?

Don't quite understand. Are you having the symptoms? My 09 has the old version but I am not in stop and go traffic so my flywheel probably will never warp. And I do not pussyfoot with it either. No ,,I am not afraid to drive it.

 

Was I angry and is it BS when my clutch went out? Sure, it was also inconvenient, stressful and senseless but I also realized that if I lost my cool I'd never get anything done. I didn't have any control over the situation.

I figured there's no sense in getting bent out of shape by something you have no control over. I simply took the GT500 to the dealer of my choice, plead my case and I was prepared. I had the Service Manager call FORD's Complaint Department while I was standing in front of him. It's really not the dealerships fault it's FORD's, so I didn't direct my anger towards them. I didn't loose my cool either! I made the dealership communicate with FORD.

I personally used another dealership other then the one I bought the car from due to it being a crap. I calmly explained my sincerity with owning a FORD. I expressed being a life long customer and that I was prepared to go else where for your transportation needs if their weren't willing to help.

I then went to the Dealership offices and voiced my concerns with the Dealership Manager. I had him make an appointment with the owner to discuss the problem in length. I didn't care if it's a month down the road either. I got the SVT Dealership Technician involved as he's aware of these issues. They are usually straight forward about telling the dealership it's a warranted fix as well as the only ones trained to work on the car. These technicians are generally paid more then the average tech and if the dealership loses one, they can't work on any GT500's. So the Service and Dealership Managers usually listen to them.

I made sure I voiced my displeasure with FORD and made a complaint with FORD Customer Loyalty. Here's the trick! SVT dealers are only permitted so many complaints against them through FORD, before they loose that status and ability to sell them. Any complaint I make against FORD directly or the dealership goes against that particular dealership you took the vehicle to. They're well aware of it also.

I explained to both the dealership and FORD, I was are aware of all the complaints that are posted on the Internet regarding the GT500 in almost every Mustang Forum. I let the FORD CUSTOMER SERVICE, SERViCE MANAGER, DEALERSHIP MANAGER and OWNER know I was aware of the TSB's involving the Clutch/Trans. I even took copies of the TSB's when to the dealership.

Now comes the moment of truth. If you've tracked the or abused the car then your going to be on your own. You have to make the decision as to what your going to tell the dealership. I'm not enticing you to lie, I'm simply conveying what I did in my particular circumstances! I didn't lie nor would I condone it just to save myself from having to pay. Ethically and morally I consider it wrong.

In the end what your going to get is a 2010/11 Clutch Assembly with Pressure Plate.

Main thing here is be calm and cool but stick to your guns. FORD knows there is a problem, you have to be willing to remind them you're aware of it. Would I have taken them to court over it? You bet, it's widely published and they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Technical Service Bulletins are not warranty recalls. They are made for technicians education and not generally publicized. They refrain from doing it simply because all the dealership receives in return, is parts voucher credits. FORD only reimburses the allotted technician time frame for repair, which is generally 3.9 hours. So while you have their technician tied up in warranty work, they aren't making their regular shop rate or what they would be making on a paid job.

You've got to voice your complaints or they will never own up to the issue. If they want to earn my business, the dealership needs to show me they will go the extra mile. Remember, this is one of the flagships of their sales fleet. FORD nor the dealerships can't afford to be stupid on such an issue with a limited production vehicle. Simple economics in a bad economy.

Cheers

Jeffafa

 

Hair Leme ES Splain,

Mine was driven normally for 16000 miles, no burnouts, no tracking or drag racing and all highway miles to and from work. Thirty minutes each way, everyday except the weekends.

It's not about if your 07, 08 & 09 GT500 has symptoms, it's when! The flywheel is going to warp, being cheaply constructed and because of it's inability to dissipate heat quickly enough. Your clutch plate will be affected in the process and will be used as the issue by the dealer. Look in your warranty pamphlet under what's not covered. Suprise, suprise suprise! How jew goin to es splain it jefe, or jew jus goin be one hombra who gets rolled in flour while they looking for de wet spot?

Do you have a small chatter when you let out the clutch without a hard load on the throttle?
Does it feel like you have excessive wheel hop on hard acceleration?
Is there a hiss when the clutch is released slowly under a light throttle load?
Does your GT want to slightly move when the clutch is fully disengaged?
Is it a bit hard to shift into first and second gears?
Do you have over 8,000 miles on the car?
Does your clutch pedal release almost at the end of it's travel?
Have you felt like the rear wheels were spinning in third under WOT?

Then you have a problem that needs to be addressed before your clutch plate wears out. Most certainly before 12,000 miles or your going to be told by the dealer it will cost you $2800 for the repair. I don't care if you have an extended warranty or preferred maintenance care. They don't cover clutch plates and this is what they will claim because it wasn't designed as a daily driver! Trust me on this one mate. If you decide to take it to a performance shop and have them put another clutch other than the SVT unit in it, FORD will null and void your drive train warranty, plain and simple.

So you have a choice. Do it yourself for about $1800, lose your drive train warranty and solve the issue? Take it to the dealer, first let them test drive it, then make them fix it under the TSB for nothing, and solve the problem without losing your drive train warranty? Additionally you'll have a 12/12,000 mile warranted repair? Choice is yours but it's pretty clear.

If my 08 GT500 develops any of the symptoms again before the warranted period is up, I'll make sure they fix it again. I can't tell you how many high horsepower cars I've owned before this one and never lost a clutch, even tracking them.

See, FORD counted on their so called limited production to develop that collector mystic that the old GT500 did. It didn't and they blew it! They were popular, they sold all they produced and they produced too many! Here's where the greed factor comes in. The more FORD sold the more money they made. Screw the collectors who gives a crap about them, I sure don't, I didn't buy mine to be a garage queen and to collect dust. Then comes the problemos. They knew their cost cutting and collectors philosophy was about to fail and bite them in they're preverbal arse. The cheap flywheels, who are produced by Valero are cast and machined, not even an SVT or FRP unit. So to stem the tide of the dreaded recall, they briefed their dealerships to inform their SVT customers, "they weren't made as daily drivers and were in fact race designed." Funny thing is, if you race or track it, your warranty is sh@t canned! They didn't mention anything about clutch problems. What they forgot is, most of the people who own them are hotrodders and tuners and didn't buy the BS the dealers were spewing. So out comes a TSB to the dealerships on the issue and screw the unknowing owner. FORD's philosophy F&*K'em or (Fu$k Over Retarded Drivers), if they don't know about it! Ford covers their arse with the TSB's if the NSF gets envolved as it's really not a safety related issue or is it? At least not until someone runs into the back of an unsuspecting GT500 owner, because they can't move their car off a major highway or road. It would take a government or major civil law suit to bring a recall to flourishen. Remember, it's one of the highest horsepower vehicles offered on the market today. They'd have no problem convincing a court, the owner caused the problem by abusing and wearing out the clutch prematurely, in the process causing the warpage of the clutch plate. Ah, but the problem lies in the input shaft, and flywheel first and is the cause of the premature wear on the clutch plate. But who's to dispute a trained SVT Technician, dealer, SVT and FORD Service? Another sure bet for FORD, why you say? Who's going to take them to court with all their money and legal backing. At least that's the way they think.

They're betting half the owners are just ignorant, believe the BS and will pay the cost of replacement, the dealer makes money, so does FORD. A third will just get feed up and replace them on their own. Then FORD can wash their hands of any wrong doing by canceling their warranties. While the remainder will pitch a bitch and FORD will repair it as laudable customer service or customer loyalty issue, just to show their great FORD Customer Care. (Bull Pucky!!) It's a win, win for them as they see it! Did the salesman ever tell you this wasn't meant as a daily driver? Did he ever tell you it was designed as a race car and was meant to be used for that purpose?

So in the long run the dealerships and FORD make money on the issue. FORD doesn't have to foot the bill for full on recall, they keep the NSF happy and either way the owners will be left holding the bag of BS left. Some of us aren't quite as stupid as they think.

Cheers

Jeffafa

 

My 07 has always shifted like a tractor, I drove a friends Viper right before I bought the GT 500 & it shifted also like a tractor/Harsh & Notchy (same transmission manufacturer)

I am amazed at how tuff the clutch is, I have a Kenne Bell stage 3 that I installed & while I do not abuse the car, I drive it pretty hard.

The Dealer installed the updated Flywheel/Clutch parts at about 6,500 miles along with all new synchros. While it has improved considerably, it simply does not compare the the ease & precision of my Integra Type R or a few other Honda & Acura automobiles I have owned. (I am a Honda Mechanic)

I really like the car, but I do not enjoy driving it as much as I wish I did because of the transmission.

I've driven several Fox bodied Mustang GT's & I remember the 5 speed & clutch package in them felt very good, I realize the Tremec 6 speed is a heavier duty unit, I am really surprised that Ford allowed it to go into production before working out the problems.

My clutch is still juddery & the trans is still notchy when shifted.

 

Replace your entire clutch assembly with the 2010 GT500 clutch. Shifting is MUCH improved. I haven't tried it on the track, yet, so I can't speak to that level of performance. But it does make daily driving much more enjoyable. I just had mine done and, so far, I'm happy with it. Ford did it under the existing warrantee...no charge.

 

Is there a way to find out if the tsb has already been done to my car? I bought it used a month ago (2007) and I'm not having the problems described....yet, with 6000 miles on it, but I'm out of the 3year warranty.

 

Alright, here's the dope! First and foremost, clutches are not covered under warranty, not their extended warranty or their preferred maintenance plan.

The problems which are identified in the TSB's put out by FORD are educational for the technicians. There is no official recall or unofficial recall on 07's, 08's or 09's. The problem with the clutch is brought about by a warped substandard flywheel and the untrue input shaft. The combination of the two together creates uneven wear on the clutch disc and also accelerates the wear on the pressure plate.

If you bought an 07 then you definitely have the problem and you can look to 12-16K and the clutch will go out. They didn't fix it on their own. Read the thread: GT500 Clutch Problems and you'll see the entire explanation.

Now, to clear up the other issue. Ford will not and I repeat will not do it under warranty. It is a manufacturing problem! Warranty has nothing to do with it. If you don't speak out regarding the issue you're going to be charged $2800 for the repair because they will blame it on normal clutch wear and at the same time they will replace all the bad parts is, Flywheel, Input Shaft, Clutch and Pressure Plate. You need to advise them of the TSB's and do not take no problem as a answer.

Stick by your guns and don't let them BS you or you're gonna get the big lower GI exam in the sky. Comprenda!

 

I am a Ford Senior Master Technician and hope to clarify things a little.

First your car has to exhibit the concerns that are specifically called out in TSB 10-03-08 as follows: " hard to disengage or engage 1st and reverse, hard to shift all gears, vehicle creeps with transmission in gear and clutch pedal fully depressed without brake pedal application. These symptoms may be caused by the clutch not disengaging fully when the clutch pedal is fully depressed. This may be due to flywheel distortion caused by excessive heat build-up during unique traffic conditions (example: severe stop/go urban driving, excessive clutch slipping). The clutch system is designed for performance driving conditions."

If your car exhibits these symptoms, it is eligible for repair under 3/36 warranty repairs per the TSB provided there is no evidence of abuse.


Per the TSB if your car exhibits any or all normal conditions as such as:

"Clutch chatter/shudder when engaging the clutch,
Narrow or abrupt engagement point,
Hiss upon clutch engagement or disengagement,
Transmission gear rollover noise at idle,
Gear rattle noise at very low speeds when in 1st or 2nd gear,
Normal wear."

It will not be repaired under warranty if it exhibits any or all of the above.

This will no doubt make some people upset, but these are the guide lines Ford has set. Hope this helps to clear some things up.

BTW, my dealership has replaced some GT500 clutches under warranty.

 

I was waiting for this! I noticed you didn't say you were an SVT certified mechanic? I think everyone here is aware of the TSB's. Frankly, I've been a trained master auto and diesel mechanic for several decades. What FORD is doing is not taking responsibility for utilizing substandard parts used in production. This is apparent by the TSB's and is a very serious Health and Safety Issue. As both a mechanic and a performance enthusiast FORD dealers using the excuse of "it's not a daily driver" is about the lamest excuse I've ever heard. You show me where it specifies the Shelby is not a daily driver in an warranty, service manual or operation manual. It doesn't exist, an it's a cop out on FORD and FORD's Dealer Network.

High performance clutches in normal street use will extend the life of the clutch as better components and materials are used in manufacturing. Aluminum or stainless steel flywheel provide better heat dissipation and resist warpage in stop and go traffic. The substandard flywheels and clutch plates which were used in the 07, 08, & 09 models are proof that you can't use cast machine garbage in an automobile with produces 500 crank horsepower. Additionally, with the poorly machined input shafts FORD were using only exacerbates the situation and accelerates the wear on the pressure and clutch plate. It also places added strain on the bearings surfaces.

"The clutch system is designed for performance driving conditions." If it was I can guarantee that we wouldn't be having the failures we are having now.

This is exactly what I challenge in FORD's methodology and verbal diatribe. Ford specifically states the if the car is use for any racing purpose, the warranty is null and void! Clutch systems which are designed for racing are much more robust for a reason. They are made for high stress, high temp, high horsepower, and high endurance operation. They are inherently stronger and last much longer then stock units but yet the SVT unit is lucky to last 12,000 in regular driving. This is not the case with ever high quality after market clutch unit sold. The Spec2 & Spec3 units easily surpass the stock unit in both durability and longevity. There easy of operation and pedal pressure is much better than the stock unit. I've know GT500 owners who have both Spec2 & 3 units who have driven their GT500's daily in excess of 50K miles in some of the worst stop and go traffic without the slightest hint of failure.

Here's some additional proof. I have a 1965 GTO 421 in excess of 750 naturally carbureted RWHP with a 5.13 rear end. Has 62,000 miles on the odometer. I've been running the Hays clutch since 1965 without any slippage or breakage for the past 30+ years, as both a daily driver and a strip car. It runs 10.50's all day long! No clutch failure as in the GT500. This is just one example.

Your dealership is not at fault on all accounts! It's solely FORD's fault of for poor production standards, faulty manufacturing, and substandard parts. All the replacement clutches are the redesigned 2010 units and the failures of the previous years were the proof of their poor engineering and necessity for change. What FORD and the Dealers Network are doing is almost considered extortion. If you complain to FORD Customer Service and Customer Loyalty they will force the dealer to replace it free of charge. If you don't complaint the $2800.00 they charge you doesn't add up to a clutch and pressure plate replacement with labor. FORD allots 3.9 man hours for installation and even at $110.00 per hour it sure doesn't add up to the $2800 for parts and labor. What's really happening is you're paying for the installation of all the new parts required in the TSB. I'm not going to let you BS anyone here with the typical denials of wrong doing on FORD's part or the instructions regarding the clutch failures passed down by FORD SVT to the dealers.

I will challenge you in every aspect of this situation. You want to play, I'll be your huckleberry and I got proof mate!

DS15 don't get your shorts in a twist. Just do what I said and you'll not have to many problems but be ready to follow up regularly and keep record of ever conversation. by the way Shelby has nothing to do with the production of the GT500. It's FORD engineered and built. Shelby had nothing to do with it's production only in name.

One other thing I found out was the NM New Car Lemon Law does cover new vehicles when they have been in the shop for over 30 consecutive day for the same problem without resolution. As it stands, FORD Customer Loyalty has elevated the status for dealers parts and has told the factory to pull from assemble stock until the manufacture can catch up on supply. Mine in has already pass 30 business days and will likely be 60 days before they even get it repaired maybe. So my wife and I are speaking to an attorney at this time. Their wither going to crap or get off the pot.

 

I am SVT certified as well as my dealership. My post was in no way meant to apologize for Ford or any dealers whom are not upholding Ford's warranty policies. I do not necessarily agree with Ford's position in regards to GT500 clutch issues. I have driven many GT500's and personally would be upset if I owned one that chattered, or slipped.

The fact of the matter is that Ford has set forth a policy and the dealerships are forced to abide by it. I posted the information I did so anyone who is interested knows the facts in regards to Ford's policy. There is plenty of misinformation posted on the web in regards to GT500 clutch issues, I am merely trying to help put an end to it.

I have not priced out a clutch replacement on a GT500 so I cannot really comment on the pricing of the job. The TSB repair does involve replacing the transmission synchronizers and input shaft if needed, so this will increase the labor to 7.7 HRS from 4.2 HRS and overall price of the repair. If it were my car I would not pay a dealer to do these repairs, I would do everything to get it covered under warranty or do the repairs myself on my own time.

My advice is to drive the car and live with the idiosyncrasies, OR put an aftermarket clutch in and be done with it, OR keep complaining to Ford Motor Company and start a class action lawsuit if you feel it necessary.

 

The "idiosyncrasies" of the GT500 are not common or normal, they're specifically related to the problems identified in the TSBs. FORD refuses to identify it as a common problem and issue a recall, due to the expenses involved and their bottom line profitability. Otherwise, they can't afford it. The recall would effect more than 15,000 FORD GT500's from 07 to 09. They are willing to sacrifice the safety of consumers for profitability, with a twist. The twist is they've involved their dealers in the cover up. They've directed and orchestrated dealers with specific dialog to present too the consumer of the GT500. It's much easier to lie to the consumer and tell them it's their responsibility as normal wear and tear for the vehicle, thus placing the owness on them. I wonder how many cooperate lawyers it took to think this one up. In the process, FORD maintains it's profitability and anonymity from the issue. The dealers also profit from the conspiracy. Conspiracy is a tough word but when two or more entities engage in a cover up to defraud consumers for the sake of saving each other's pocketbook, that's exactly what it's called. FORD is perputuating the Fraud. Conspiracy Theroy you say! We'll see about that!

 

Nicely put -I'm currently getting shafted by Ford as well with 2011 GT500 SVT with 4,000 miles and all ready replaced the clutch. I'm flabbergasted, appalled, and dumfounded by this notion of BUILT TOUGH. Where is the love?