[Shelbymustang] Modern collectible cars

TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
------------------------------------
Hmmmmmmmm. So the price of gas and the projected price of gas might inhibit some from buying "gas guzzlers?" Sounds like history all over again. I wonder how many more car nuts would have held on to their "gas guzzling" Shelbys or Mustangs with the big block engines, had they only known that there really was no gas crisis and that gasoline would once again become plentiful. I wonder if anyone has sat down and done a cost analysis of gasoline prices from the 1970's until now, factoring in inflation? I suspect that today's gas prices, if not a bargain, are not all that far out of line. While it is a lot of fun to speculate, I would also suspect that perhaps we, as a group, may be the wrong generation to be trying to forecast what might happen to today's "classics" in the future. Those decisions will, in all likelihood, be made by our children and/or grand children and who knows what will turn them on? For example, the cars our fathers coveted were, in most cases, completely different than our choices. And how many of us own the model cars our fathers drooled over? Model T's? Or Tuckers? Or Auburns? Or........you get the idea. I think each generation will determine what turns them on, and it could well be that none of the current crop of "new classics" will be their choice.
But, having pontificated on these points, I think I would pick the Roush Saleen, or any Saleen for that matter. I think Steve Saleen could well be the future CS. But there I go trying to predict the future again. Shucks, I'm not sure what we are having for dinner tomorrow.
Something to think about.
Have a great day.
Ron

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TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
------------------------------------
On Thu, 27 Jul 2006, Ronald. Robertson wrote:
>Hmmmmmmmm. So the price of gas and the projected price of gas might
>inhibit some from buying "gas guzzlers?" Sounds like history all over
>again. I wonder how many more car nuts would have held on to their
>"gas guzzling" Shelbys or Mustangs with the big block engines,
>had they only known that there really was no gas crisis and that
>gasoline would once again become plentiful. I wonder if anyone has
>sat down and done a cost analysis of gasoline prices from the 1970's
>until now, factoring in inflation? I suspect that today's gas
>prices, if not a bargain, are not all that far out of line.

I have read about the comparison. The peak of gasoline prices back then
was sometime during the "shortages" during the Carter administration.
Inflation corrected that equates to about $3.00/gallon today. So we are
right at that, and I think we might be looking at things getting worse
unfortunately.

Back then, there were artificial shortages. Today, I have been trying to
read through all of the politics involved and get to the truth about our
current supply situation (everyone has an agenda, and everyone uses this
issue to fruther their agenda), and the one thing that is apparent is that
the amount of oil going to Mainland China and India is increasing at very
rapid rates. These countries are growing out of being 3rd world countries
and being true industrial nations. They each have lots and lots of people.
This is not a trend that is going to turn around unfortunately.

It used to be that if we didn't buy crude oil from one of the oil
producing countries, then they didn't have many options on where to sell
it. But today, there is a growing world demand, even though our demand has
not gone up very much. So the producers can get higher prices by just
selling to China or someone, if we don't buy it.

As artificial as the "shortages" in the 70's were, our supply situation
today is very different than it has ever been. I don't see us ever going
back to the supply-demand situation we were in as recently as 5 years ago.

I don't know what effect this will have on our current performance cars,
but it has had a huge effect on the SUV sales already.

Calvin
http://www.racecarstuff.com <<--my blog
http://motors.search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZcalvin767 <<--my ebay stuff

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------------------------------------
In a message dated 7/27/2006 8:07:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
ronald.robertson (AT) sympatico (DOT) ca writes:
And how many of us own the model cars our fathers drooled over? Model T's? Or
Tuckers? Or Auburns?
Ron & everyone,

Actually, I have a few and enjoy them immensely. As a child of the 60's, my
initial forays into the field were from that era- a couple of Lincoln
convertibles, various Mustangs, etc. As our collection grew, I've been amazed at how
many 50's cars have found their way to my warehouse, and each time it was more
of an appreciation of the car as rolling art as opposed to performance- e.g.,
the 56 Continental Mark II, 55 Thunderbird, 58 Bentley Flying Spur, and the
59 Skyliner which, although a restomod, is hardly a performance car. In the
spirit of every collector having a car from the year he/she was born, mine is a
48 Ford Woody wagon.

Then there are the prewars- in my case, all from 1937- a Zephyr streetrod, a
Derby Bentley, and a Phantom III Rolls-Royce. The latter two are marvelous
examples of 30's engineering, particularly the PIII, which is easily the most
complicated, challenging, and interesting car in the fold- a one-off "Cabriolet
de Ville" dual-ignition V12 with 24 sparkplugs, two distributors, dual fuel
pumps, permanently-mounted jacks at all four corners, independent front
suspension- I could go on, but the best part is driving it down the road.

My kids, who are in their 20's, all seem to share the muscle-car fascination,
but that may be a function of all the attention being paid to them these
days. Whether that will persist is for time to tell.

I believe that there are qualities to admire in all eras. I've had a ride in
the Veteran Car Club's London-to-Brighton run in a 1902 Curved-Dash Olds that
I wouldn't trade for anything (it was a relatively dry day, thank God), and
my next purchase may well be a Model A Roadster, assuming the 07 GT500 won't
show up at my small-town dealer for a while.

Call me crazy, but cars from many eras are interesting to me as long as I can
DRIVE them. In my collection, the ones that sit are the ones that go sooner
rather than later.

As for future collectibility, I think I've posted already about that, and on
further thought I'm going to have to agree wth those that feel that most of
our modern, serial-production cars have only a limited chance of proving
collectible (defined as worth more than we paid for them) in our lifetimes.

Cheers,
Mike Heroy
CSX4045
67 GT500 #841
68 GT500 #389

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TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
------------------------------------
As you get older you start appreciating the older cars, when I was in my teens and 20s I would hardly look at older cars, I now love all the old ones, we have some model As which everyone needs to own one just to know how simple things used to be they are a ball to work on, we also have some 30s and 40s Fords, the 1932 through 1940 Fords, Coupes and Convertibles are some of the most beautiful cars ever produced, I look at cars like art and the guy that drew those knew what he was doing, it shows because every repro street rod body they ever reproduce is a Ford from this era. I also have a 1940 Ford Woody I`m in love with just because it is so odd. So I like the old Shelbys and I like the new cars, but you can never forget what got them to that point, just remember a 40 Ford Coupe was about 850 dollars new, and a very good example today, a restored good bodied car or a good original is worth 25 to 45 thousand that is 25 to 45 times what it costed new. Just think about that for a minute and there are plenty more old cars that will put that to shame.
----- Original Message -----
From: MHeroy (AT) aol (DOT) com
To: shelbymustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Shelbymustang] Modern collectible cars


TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
------------------------------------


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


In a message dated 7/27/2006 8:07:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, ronald.robertson (AT) sympatico (DOT) ca writes:
And how many of us own the model cars our fathers drooled over? Model T's? Or Tuckers? Or Auburns?
Ron & everyone,

Actually, I have a few and enjoy them immensely. As a child of the 60's, my initial forays into the field were from that era- a couple of Lincoln convertibles, various Mustangs, etc. As our collection grew, I've been amazed at how many 50's cars have found their way to my warehouse, and each time it was more of an appreciation of the car as rolling art as opposed to performance- e.g., the 56 Continental Mark II, 55 Thunderbird, 58 Bentley Flying Spur, and the 59 Skyliner which, although a restomod, is hardly a performance car. In the spirit of every collector having a car from the year he/she was born, mine is a 48 Ford Woody wagon.

Then there are the prewars- in my case, all from 1937- a Zephyr streetrod, a Derby Bentley, and a Phantom III Rolls-Royce. The latter two are marvelous examples of 30's engineering, particularly the PIII, which is easily the most complicated, challenging, and interesting car in the fold- a one-off "Cabriolet de Ville" dual-ignition V12 with 24 sparkplugs, two distributors, dual fuel pumps, permanently-mounted jacks at all four corners, independent front suspension- I could go on, but the best part is driving it down the road.

My kids, who are in their 20's, all seem to share the muscle-car fascination, but that may be a function of all the attention being paid to them these days. Whether that will persist is for time to tell.

I believe that there are qualities to admire in all eras. I've had a ride in the Veteran Car Club's London-to-Brighton run in a 1902 Curved-Dash Olds that I wouldn't trade for anything (it was a relatively dry day, thank God), and my next purchase may well be a Model A Roadster, assuming the 07 GT500 won't show up at my small-town dealer for a while.

Call me crazy, but cars from many eras are interesting to me as long as I can DRIVE them. In my collection, the ones that sit are the ones that go sooner rather than later.

As for future collectibility, I think I've posted already about that, and on further thought I'm going to have to agree wth those that feel that most of our modern, serial-production cars have only a limited chance of proving collectible (defined as worth more than we paid for them) in our lifetimes.

Cheers,
Mike Heroy
CSX4045
67 GT500 #841
68 GT500 #389



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------------------------------------
I think the cars that the public can identify with are the ones that will
be collectible in the future. This identification process can be achieved
by exposure through racing, pop culture or personal experiences.

Being a child of the 80's, I associated with limited performance cars of
the era (Countach, Boxer, TR, Grand National, 5.0 Coupe, Vector, etc.).
But as a result of being an enthusiast in the 80's, magazines and media
looked back to the golden era in the 60s and early 70s with fondness. So,
naturally, I started appreciating the Shelby Cobra, Daytona, Miura, GT350,
etc. even though I wasn't close to being alive when they came out.

For cars such as the Mustang variants, it seems that production numbers
and performance are going to be key. The new Mustang as a publicly
identifiable object sure is getting a lot of press...probably a good sign
for the more desirable models 20-30 yrs down the road.

LS
'66 GT350
'67 GT350
'97 Cobra



--- Andy Killian <andyk1 (AT) charter (DOT) net> wrote:

> TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
> ------------------------------------> As you get older you start
appreciating the older cars, when I was in my
> teens and 20s I would hardly look at older cars, I now love all the old
> ones, we have some model As which everyone needs to own one just to know
> how simple things used to be they are a ball to work on, we also have
> some 30s and 40s Fords, the 1932 through 1940 Fords, Coupes and
> Convertibles are some of the most beautiful cars ever produced, I look
> at cars like art and the guy that drew those knew what he was doing, it
> shows because every repro street rod body they ever reproduce is a Ford
> from this era. I also have a 1940 Ford Woody I`m in love with just
> because it is so odd. So I like the old Shelbys and I like the new cars,
> but you can never forget what got them to that point, just remember a 40
> Ford Coupe was about 850 dollars new, and a very good example today, a
> restored good bodied car or a good original is worth 25 to 45 thousand
> that is 25 to 45 times what it costed new. Just think about that for a
> minute and there are plenty more old cars that will put that to shame.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: MHeroy (AT) aol (DOT) com
> To: shelbymustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 11:19 AM
> Subject: Re: [Shelbymustang] Modern collectible cars
>
>
> TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
> ------------------------------------
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> In a message dated 7/27/2006 8:07:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> ronald.robertson (AT) sympatico (DOT) ca writes:
> And how many of us own the model cars our fathers drooled over?
> Model T's? Or Tuckers? Or Auburns?
> Ron & everyone,
>
> Actually, I have a few and enjoy them immensely. As a child of the
> 60's, my initial forays into the field were from that era- a couple of
> Lincoln convertibles, various Mustangs, etc. As our collection grew,
> I've been amazed at how many 50's cars have found their way to my
> warehouse, and each time it was more of an appreciation of the car as
> rolling art as opposed to performance- e.g., the 56 Continental Mark II,
> 55 Thunderbird, 58 Bentley Flying Spur, and the 59 Skyliner which,
> although a restomod, is hardly a performance car. In the spirit of
> every collector having a car from the year he/she was born, mine is a 48
> Ford Woody wagon.
>
> Then there are the prewars- in my case, all from 1937- a Zephyr
> streetrod, a Derby Bentley, and a Phantom III Rolls-Royce. The latter
> two are marvelous examples of 30's engineering, particularly the PIII,
> which is easily the most complicated, challenging, and interesting car
> in the fold- a one-off "Cabriolet de Ville" dual-ignition V12 with 24
> sparkplugs, two distributors, dual fuel pumps, permanently-mounted jacks
> at all four corners, independent front suspension- I could go on, but
> the best part is driving it down the road.
>
> My kids, who are in their 20's, all seem to share the muscle-car
> fascination, but that may be a function of all the attention being paid
> to them these days. Whether that will persist is for time to tell.
>
> I believe that there are qualities to admire in all eras. I've had a
> ride in the Veteran Car Club's London-to-Brighton run in a 1902
> Curved-Dash Olds that I wouldn't trade for anything (it was a relatively
> dry day, thank God), and my next purchase may well be a Model A
> Roadster, assuming the 07 GT500 won't show up at my small-town dealer
> for a while.
>
> Call me crazy, but cars from many eras are interesting to me as long
> as I can DRIVE them. In my collection, the ones that sit are the ones
> that go sooner rather than later.
>
> As for future collectibility, I think I've posted already about that,
> and on further thought I'm going to have to agree wth those that feel
> that most of our modern, serial-production cars have only a limited
> chance of proving collectible (defined as worth more than we paid for
> them) in our lifetimes.
>
> Cheers,
> Mike Heroy
> CSX4045
> 67 GT500 #841
> 68 GT500 #389
>
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ShelbyMustang mailing list
> Send email to ShelbyMustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> Membership Administration
> http://thecarsource.com/mailman/listinfo/shelbymustang_thecarsource.com
> Group Web Page http://www.thecarsource.com/shelbymustang
> > _______________________________________________
> ShelbyMustang mailing list
> Send email to ShelbyMustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> Membership Administration
> http://thecarsource.com/mailman/listinfo/shelbymustang_thecarsource.com
> Group Web Page http://www.thecarsource.com/shelbymustang


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TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
------------------------------------
Jim, there would be two answers from me based on collectibility and on
enjoyment. I think that collectibility wise the factory Shelby GT500 will
always be worth more than any "tuner" variant assuming they don't make
15,000 units. And I think that is because it will always have more pop
culture exposure in tv, film, magazines, etc.

I'm a minimalist from a car point of view, I love the idea of the new
GT500, but can't get over the extreme weight and relatively tame looks.
Having said that, if I found a good deal on a used one when the market
cools off, I'd be tempted because at the end of the day, it's still a
500bhp factory Mustang, rare or not. Although, I think the 2000 Cobra R
still would be a better choice overall from a purity of driving and
investment standpoint. I'm waiting for a normally aspirated 450bhp GT350R
stripped down at 3200lbs. But, the original discussion was on the 2007
models, so I digress...

Thanks,
LS

--- ecj <ecj (AT) peoplepc (DOT) com> wrote:

> You have made some very good points, I asked the question to get some
> chatter from the group. I was hoping to also get everyone's opinion on
> what Mustang they'd pick out of all the 2007 street Mustangs available.
>
>
> Which would buy if you were to buy one?
>
> Jim Seisser
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: LS <lashdeep (AT) yahoo (DOT) com>
> >Sent: Jul 28, 2006 7:31 PM
> >To: Andy Killian <andyk1 (AT) charter (DOT) net>, MHeroy (AT) aol (DOT) com,
> shelbymustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> >Subject: Re: [Shelbymustang] Modern collectible cars
> >
> >TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
> >------------------------------------
> >I think the cars that the public can identify with are the ones that
> will
> >be collectible in the future. This identification process can be
> achieved
> >by exposure through racing, pop culture or personal experiences.
> >
> >Being a child of the 80's, I associated with limited performance cars
> of
> >the era (Countach, Boxer, TR, Grand National, 5.0 Coupe, Vector, etc.).
> >But as a result of being an enthusiast in the 80's, magazines and media
> >looked back to the golden era in the 60s and early 70s with fondness.
> So,
> >naturally, I started appreciating the Shelby Cobra, Daytona, Miura,
> GT350,
> >etc. even though I wasn't close to being alive when they came out.
> >
> >For cars such as the Mustang variants, it seems that production numbers
> >and performance are going to be key. The new Mustang as a publicly
> >identifiable object sure is getting a lot of press...probably a good
> sign
> >for the more desirable models 20-30 yrs down the road.
> >
> >LS
> >'66 GT350
> >'67 GT350
> >'97 Cobra
> >
> >
> >
> >--- Andy Killian <andyk1 (AT) charter (DOT) net> wrote:
> >
> >> TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
> >> ------------------------------------> As you get older you start
> >appreciating the older cars, when I was in my
> >> teens and 20s I would hardly look at older cars, I now love all the
> old
> >> ones, we have some model As which everyone needs to own one just to
> know
> >> how simple things used to be they are a ball to work on, we also have
> >> some 30s and 40s Fords, the 1932 through 1940 Fords, Coupes and
> >> Convertibles are some of the most beautiful cars ever produced, I
> look
> >> at cars like art and the guy that drew those knew what he was doing,
> it
> >> shows because every repro street rod body they ever reproduce is a
> Ford
> >> from this era. I also have a 1940 Ford Woody I`m in love with just
> >> because it is so odd. So I like the old Shelbys and I like the new
> cars,
> >> but you can never forget what got them to that point, just remember a
> 40
> >> Ford Coupe was about 850 dollars new, and a very good example today,
> a
> >> restored good bodied car or a good original is worth 25 to 45
> thousand
> >> that is 25 to 45 times what it costed new. Just think about that for
> a
> >> minute and there are plenty more old cars that will put that to
> shame.
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: MHeroy (AT) aol (DOT) com
> >> To: shelbymustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> >> Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 11:19 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [Shelbymustang] Modern collectible cars
> >>
> >>
> >> TheCarSource.com Shelby Mustang List
> >> ------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >> In a message dated 7/27/2006 8:07:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> >> ronald.robertson (AT) sympatico (DOT) ca writes:
> >> And how many of us own the model cars our fathers drooled over?
> >> Model T's? Or Tuckers? Or Auburns?
> >> Ron & everyone,
> >>
> >> Actually, I have a few and enjoy them immensely. As a child of the
> >> 60's, my initial forays into the field were from that era- a couple
> of
> >> Lincoln convertibles, various Mustangs, etc. As our collection grew,
> >> I've been amazed at how many 50's cars have found their way to my
> >> warehouse, and each time it was more of an appreciation of the car as
> >> rolling art as opposed to performance- e.g., the 56 Continental Mark
> II,
> >> 55 Thunderbird, 58 Bentley Flying Spur, and the 59 Skyliner which,
> >> although a restomod, is hardly a performance car. In the spirit of
> >> every collector having a car from the year he/she was born, mine is a
> 48
> >> Ford Woody wagon.
> >>
> >> Then there are the prewars- in my case, all from 1937- a Zephyr
> >> streetrod, a Derby Bentley, and a Phantom III Rolls-Royce. The
> latter
> >> two are marvelous examples of 30's engineering, particularly the
> PIII,
> >> which is easily the most complicated, challenging, and interesting
> car
> >> in the fold- a one-off "Cabriolet de Ville" dual-ignition V12 with 24
> >> sparkplugs, two distributors, dual fuel pumps, permanently-mounted
> jacks
> >> at all four corners, independent front suspension- I could go on, but
> >> the best part is driving it down the road.
> >>
> >> My kids, who are in their 20's, all seem to share the muscle-car
> >> fascination, but that may be a function of all the attention being
> paid
> >> to them these days. Whether that will persist is for time to tell.
> >>
> >> I believe that there are qualities to admire in all eras. I've had
> a
> >> ride in the Veteran Car Club's London-to-Brighton run in a 1902
> >> Curved-Dash Olds that I wouldn't trade for anything (it was a
> relatively
> >> dry day, thank God), and my next purchase may well be a Model A
> >> Roadster, assuming the 07 GT500 won't show up at my small-town dealer
> >> for a while.
> >>
> >> Call me crazy, but cars from many eras are interesting to me as
> long
> >> as I can DRIVE them. In my collection, the ones that sit are the
> ones
> >> that go sooner rather than later.
> >>
> >> As for future collectibility, I think I've posted already about
> that,
> >> and on further thought I'm going to have to agree wth those that feel
> >> that most of our modern, serial-production cars have only a limited
> >> chance of proving collectible (defined as worth more than we paid for
> >> them) in our lifetimes.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Mike Heroy
> >> CSX4045
> >> 67 GT500 #841
> >> 68 GT500 #389
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> ShelbyMustang mailing list
> >> Send email to ShelbyMustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> >> Membership Administration
> >>
> http://thecarsource.com/mailman/listinfo/shelbymustang_thecarsource.com
> >> Group Web Page http://www.thecarsource.com/shelbymustang
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> ShelbyMustang mailing list
> >> Send email to ShelbyMustang (AT) thecarsource (DOT) com
> >> Membership Administration
> >>
> http://thecarsource.com/mailman/listinfo/shelbymustang_thecarsource.com
> >> Group Web Page http://www.thecarsource.com/shelbymustang
> >
> >
> >www.exhaust.tv
> >
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>
>
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